Question about the anti-piracy thing in Whistler
As first reported in WinInfo Daily UPDATE, Microsoft will institute an anti-piracy measure in Whistler, the next version of Windows 2000, that will tie the Product Key to the machine ID of the first PC on which its installed.
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As first reported in WinInfo Daily UPDATE, Microsoft will institute an anti-piracy measure in Whistler, the next version of Windows 2000, that will tie the Product Key to the machine ID of the first PC on which its installed. Dubbed "product activation" by the company, the feature is designed to reduce casual copying by requiring the Internet- or phone-based registration, or activation, of Whistler before it can be used. This process will create a unique identification code for that particular installation based on the Product Key that was entered and certain criteria from the hardware configuration. If the user attempts to install that copy of Whistler on a different machine with the same Product Key, the activation will fail. Whistler's product activation feature is similar to that used by Office 10, which will debut a few months before the Whistler desktop versions.
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Ok...the idea of tying the CD key with the machine is a good idea in theory. I'm buying it anyway...so piracy isn't a problem for me.
But what about us that change our systems(say going from one motherboard to another, new CPU, etc.). I would assume this would change our machine ID. Then what? Do we have to go buy a new copy of Whistler just because we changed machines?
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My PC is warm. I think our fire wall is acting up.
As first reported in WinInfo Daily UPDATE, Microsoft will institute an anti-piracy measure in Whistler, the next version of Windows 2000, that will tie the Product Key to the machine ID of the first PC on which its installed. Dubbed "product activation" by the company, the feature is designed to reduce casual copying by requiring the Internet- or phone-based registration, or activation, of Whistler before it can be used. This process will create a unique identification code for that particular installation based on the Product Key that was entered and certain criteria from the hardware configuration. If the user attempts to install that copy of Whistler on a different machine with the same Product Key, the activation will fail. Whistler's product activation feature is similar to that used by Office 10, which will debut a few months before the Whistler desktop versions.
""
Ok...the idea of tying the CD key with the machine is a good idea in theory. I'm buying it anyway...so piracy isn't a problem for me.
But what about us that change our systems(say going from one motherboard to another, new CPU, etc.). I would assume this would change our machine ID. Then what? Do we have to go buy a new copy of Whistler just because we changed machines?
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My PC is warm. I think our fire wall is acting up.
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Well the Linux crowd will most definetly increase in size 15% on day of Whistler release if this is true.
Don't worry this will be easily crackable and I'm sure that the OS given out to business's/government. (SELECT versions) probably will have this feature disabled.
If you read this:
the feature is designed to reduce casual copying
You can compare that to CloneCD if you wish. Wich stops casual copying (A newbie trying to copy with Creator). So with most users being the idiots they are and not wanting a "cracked" OS to them the OS will be un-crackable and they will buy it.
The rest of us will either get our Work copies or the crack off the net. No worries here.
*Now I'm off to brush up on my linux skillz in case I'm wrong. Linux will have the power of DOSFREAK!
Don't worry this will be easily crackable and I'm sure that the OS given out to business's/government. (SELECT versions) probably will have this feature disabled.
If you read this:
the feature is designed to reduce casual copying
You can compare that to CloneCD if you wish. Wich stops casual copying (A newbie trying to copy with Creator). So with most users being the idiots they are and not wanting a "cracked" OS to them the OS will be un-crackable and they will buy it.
The rest of us will either get our Work copies or the crack off the net. No worries here.
*Now I'm off to brush up on my linux skillz in case I'm wrong. Linux will have the power of DOSFREAK!
but I'm talking about legitimate use. not cracking.
What would have to be done to migrate from one system to the next, without cracking or stuff like. God help me--"The legal and right way"?
What would have to be done to migrate from one system to the next, without cracking or stuff like. God help me--"The legal and right way"?
What does it mean by Machine ID? It's not just talking about the computer name is it? If so, that's pathetic really. What happens if you don't "activate" it?
What will happen, Whistler will only operate as a registration form until you activitate it? Or are they more likely to give you a few days to get around to doing it, and then have Whistler turn into the most expensive program form you ever bought?
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brainsoft, Xi Base & JJR512.com Co-Administrator.
XiBase/ JJR512 Activelist: 83320323
"I don't know how I got here, I was only looking for the washroom."
What will happen, Whistler will only operate as a registration form until you activitate it? Or are they more likely to give you a few days to get around to doing it, and then have Whistler turn into the most expensive program form you ever bought?
------------------
brainsoft, Xi Base & JJR512.com Co-Administrator.
XiBase/ JJR512 Activelist: 83320323
"I don't know how I got here, I was only looking for the washroom."
This is a good point, about changing out parts.
Does this mean we have to save a key, like PGP?
Also, what about those without modems or any I'net connection? I have two computers, but only one is hooked to the 'Net right now.
I don't have a huge problem with running a cracked version [my Win2K install as witness], but I'd prefer to have a legal version [given the money]. I think inablility to get ICS working shouldn't bar me from upgrading my second computer, and if I was to throw the modem in the second machine, would that modify the ID number?
Inane ramblings....
-bZj
Does this mean we have to save a key, like PGP?
Also, what about those without modems or any I'net connection? I have two computers, but only one is hooked to the 'Net right now.
I don't have a huge problem with running a cracked version [my Win2K install as witness], but I'd prefer to have a legal version [given the money]. I think inablility to get ICS working shouldn't bar me from upgrading my second computer, and if I was to throw the modem in the second machine, would that modify the ID number?
Inane ramblings....
-bZj
some of you have mentioned that they can't write the data on the cd, but that's not the point. The activation process records your machine id and product key on MS's servers.
Supposedly though you can call them to get it changed if you change your hardware.
Also, it gives you 30 days lee-way to activate it, so for those of you who re-install more than once a month, it won't be a problem
Supposedly though you can call them to get it changed if you change your hardware.
Also, it gives you 30 days lee-way to activate it, so for those of you who re-install more than once a month, it won't be a problem
WOOHOO!!! FORMAT AND REINSTALL EVERY MONTH.
thats why i said to remove communication devices I.E. Modem/NIC, how would it connect to the MS Servers then? It couldn't. If it crippled itself after 30days just cause i didn't give it an internet connection, thats bullsh1t, i'll use Linux or stick with Windows 2000 (best $300 i ever paid).
thats why i said to remove communication devices I.E. Modem/NIC, how would it connect to the MS Servers then? It couldn't. If it crippled itself after 30days just cause i didn't give it an internet connection, thats bullsh1t, i'll use Linux or stick with Windows 2000 (best $300 i ever paid).
Most of this is speculation, but what I would plan to do is to block access to Microsoft on my firewall (Home LAN, obviously).
There is bound to be some snail mail way of registering the product and getting a code that will disable the 30 day timeout.
This code is likely to be a lot more portable between machines (I'm hoping here that the registration form doesn't go into huge detail about your BIOS number, Hard disk serial numbers and so on).
With a bit of luck that will solve all the problems of an upgrade. Failing that, I'll just use the Select version.
There is bound to be some snail mail way of registering the product and getting a code that will disable the 30 day timeout.
This code is likely to be a lot more portable between machines (I'm hoping here that the registration form doesn't go into huge detail about your BIOS number, Hard disk serial numbers and so on).
With a bit of luck that will solve all the problems of an upgrade. Failing that, I'll just use the Select version.
From www.theregister.co.uk....
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Copy protection on Whistler easily cracked
By: John Lettice
Posted: 19/01/2001 at 13:26 GMT
Whistler's copy protection is by no means uncrackable, according to various of The Register's shady sources. The hardware-locked key system currently shipping with the Whistler beta seems to be fairly easy to get around, and the inconvenience of the system - if it ships with the production Whistler - will be likely to encourage the widespread use of cracks, and even of doctored installation disks that are entirely unlocked.
As we said the other month, the greater the inconvenience for the user that comes with anti-piracy measures, the more likely the users are going to feel morally justified in ripping the protection off. Whistler protection sounds like one of Microsoft's most inconvenient methods ever, so go figure.
Whistler (along with Office 10) uses a combination of a CD key and a code generated from the specific machine's hardware to generate another code, which is then validated by Microsoft by phone or over the Web, and you get another key which unlocks the software. You can't use it on two different machines,* and if you change your hardware and need to reinstall the key you have isn't valid. It's aggravating for ordinary users, and likely to be crippling for systems admins who want to be able to do multiple installs simply.
But the protection isn't rocket science, and we're told the following method works (as we don't yet have the version of Whistler with the protection, we can't verify it):
1. Disconnect from any network.
2. Start the install, but don't use dynamic update (which wants to connect, right?)
3. After installation and on first boot, don't set up your Internet connection when it asks. Click next or skip - the wizard will crash when you click next.
4. Click Start/Run and type:
regsrv32.exe -u regwizc.dll
Close the confirmation window that appears.
5. Start/run: regedit
6. Under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsNT\CurrentVersion change RegDone value to 1
7. Open up Internet Explorer. Open the Tools/Internet Properties and change your home page to something that isn't Microsoft or MSN.
8. Reboot and before windows starts up, plug your network connection back in.
Basically, the protection is circumventable with just a little bit of detouring and a regedit. Microsoft no doubt knows this, but is presumably banking on most users going along with the process, as they've tended to do in the past. But as we say, the inconvenience factor may well change the ratios.
And another thing worth considering - granted ordinary users who've paid for the software will tend to just go through the process as specified by Microsoft, but who are the people most motivated not to? That's right, it's the pirates the system is supposed to be tackling. Pirates will make it their business to know how to rip off the protection and burn the software onto modified install CDs, which they'll then sell cheap. If the protection isn't very good - which it isn't - then they don't have any more trouble with it than before, so Microsoft hits the honest punters, misses the target entirely, and maybe co-opts the people in the middle into the twilight zone of legality.
So friends, is this system really intended to tackle piracy at all? Isn't it perhaps more plausible to think of the objective as being to enforce universal registration of Microsoft products with Microsoft?
* On this subject, we're not sure where this leaves the legendary 'two machine' Microsoft licence agreement. According to the Microsoft site some licences allow to run the software on two machines, say, office and portable, but just not at the same time. We don't know who gets these licences, we know all ours say just the one machine, so it may be an academic question anyway.
=============================================
Copy protection on Whistler easily cracked
By: John Lettice
Posted: 19/01/2001 at 13:26 GMT
Whistler's copy protection is by no means uncrackable, according to various of The Register's shady sources. The hardware-locked key system currently shipping with the Whistler beta seems to be fairly easy to get around, and the inconvenience of the system - if it ships with the production Whistler - will be likely to encourage the widespread use of cracks, and even of doctored installation disks that are entirely unlocked.
As we said the other month, the greater the inconvenience for the user that comes with anti-piracy measures, the more likely the users are going to feel morally justified in ripping the protection off. Whistler protection sounds like one of Microsoft's most inconvenient methods ever, so go figure.
Whistler (along with Office 10) uses a combination of a CD key and a code generated from the specific machine's hardware to generate another code, which is then validated by Microsoft by phone or over the Web, and you get another key which unlocks the software. You can't use it on two different machines,* and if you change your hardware and need to reinstall the key you have isn't valid. It's aggravating for ordinary users, and likely to be crippling for systems admins who want to be able to do multiple installs simply.
But the protection isn't rocket science, and we're told the following method works (as we don't yet have the version of Whistler with the protection, we can't verify it):
1. Disconnect from any network.
2. Start the install, but don't use dynamic update (which wants to connect, right?)
3. After installation and on first boot, don't set up your Internet connection when it asks. Click next or skip - the wizard will crash when you click next.
4. Click Start/Run and type:
regsrv32.exe -u regwizc.dll
Close the confirmation window that appears.
5. Start/run: regedit
6. Under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsNT\CurrentVersion change RegDone value to 1
7. Open up Internet Explorer. Open the Tools/Internet Properties and change your home page to something that isn't Microsoft or MSN.
8. Reboot and before windows starts up, plug your network connection back in.
Basically, the protection is circumventable with just a little bit of detouring and a regedit. Microsoft no doubt knows this, but is presumably banking on most users going along with the process, as they've tended to do in the past. But as we say, the inconvenience factor may well change the ratios.
And another thing worth considering - granted ordinary users who've paid for the software will tend to just go through the process as specified by Microsoft, but who are the people most motivated not to? That's right, it's the pirates the system is supposed to be tackling. Pirates will make it their business to know how to rip off the protection and burn the software onto modified install CDs, which they'll then sell cheap. If the protection isn't very good - which it isn't - then they don't have any more trouble with it than before, so Microsoft hits the honest punters, misses the target entirely, and maybe co-opts the people in the middle into the twilight zone of legality.
So friends, is this system really intended to tackle piracy at all? Isn't it perhaps more plausible to think of the objective as being to enforce universal registration of Microsoft products with Microsoft?
* On this subject, we're not sure where this leaves the legendary 'two machine' Microsoft licence agreement. According to the Microsoft site some licences allow to run the software on two machines, say, office and portable, but just not at the same time. We don't know who gets these licences, we know all ours say just the one machine, so it may be an academic question anyway.
well i know that this 'registration' is already active or was in the one of the first release of whislter that got out, it was cracked and fixed a.s.a.p and u can block it with your firewall fine!, if anythign i can see it beign like q3 or HL, as in it is 1 key per user and each key can only be registered once etc etc blah blah!!! we all knwo how this works, and i can see it happening with this o/s, or as also previously mention by MS, they have the idea of offering software as a 'subscribed' service, as in u pay a fee to use the soaftware as u need off of dam fast servers (basically an application server), etc etc and it is alwasy updated for u, u merely pay your fee's and u got access to it, literally having no software on your computer, this is also a future dream of MS, frankl;y i can't see it happning!! if i got software i want the dam cd in my hands!!! anyways l8's for now
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=========================
ICQ me!!!
========Specs========
ASUS P3V4X
VARIOUS O/C SETTINGS
PIII 533 @ 640 133fsb
PIII 533 @ 584 150fsb
384mb PC133
20gIBM 7200 rpm
40g MAxtor 7200rpm
Sound Blaster LIVE!!! Platinum
ATI All-In-Wonder 128 32mb 2x Agp
19'Samsung SyncMaster 950p
Logitech Wireless keyboard/Mouse
Creative 52x cdrom
Richo CD-R/RW MP7040a 4/4/32
Epson Stylus colour 760
Cable modem
and i networked with a MAC G3, now sharing printer/hardrives and internet.
WOW, aren't i special now
AND iT ALL WORKS GRRRREAT!!!'
